ACC-HE

回復 40# spoonek4

did you do that on purpose?

spoonek4

叫做啦，想試下令份尾rotate得快少少，不過就做得過火左......

Derek128

Just telling ACC-HE that if he wanna try the track, it's fairly safe as long as he's not reckless. With VSA ON, oversteer should be the least of his concern
BiscottiGelato 發表於 2010-7-1 17:43

RWD 太多油會甩
VSA 可以令你唔甩

FWD trail brake, 彎中 Lift throttle 個尾會出
VSA 可能會令你救唔到架車


希望fanbanlo 知道understeer & oversteer O既成因 先至去track day la

ACC-HE

just looked at more pics on track day... my TSX so stock, and AT, will be laughed at for the whole day la.
Not to mention the OE pad and rotor, I'm afraid I can no longer stop the car after a lap or 2.

Maybe I should stay with AutoX shuen la... haha....

Derek128

Maybe I should stay with AutoX shuen la... haha....
ACC-HE 發表於 2010-7-2 00:04

then hopefully we can see you this sunday
haven't see you for a long time
we had a few AT cars for thye last 2 event
they were doing fine

ACC-HE

then hopefully we can see you this sunday
haven't see you for a long time
we had a few AT cars for ...
Derek128 發表於 2010-7-2 12:17

NICE! Thanks for the head up, who's going??

Sunday, July 4th       
Mostly Cloudy        High 18°C
Cloudy with sunny periods. Chance of showers.

BiscottiGelato

RWD 太多油會甩
VSA 可以令你唔甩

FWD trail brake, 彎中 Lift throttle 個尾會出
VSA 可能會令你救唔到 ...
Derek128 發表於 2010-7-1 23:40

RWD Power Oversteer
DSC cuts throttle/apply brakes to outer wheels

RWD Lift off Oversteer
DSC pply brakes to outer wheels to stop spin momentum

FWD Lift off Oversteer
VSA apply brakes to outer (in Honda's case, outer front) wheel

In no case wll stability control systems apply gas to any wheels for correction (not with low end systems from BMW/VSA from Honda anyways). I am no control engineer of any vehicle stability systems here. From what I've seen + some of my interpretation, stability systems simply does not recover the vehicle the way a driver will recover the vehicle (via restoration of weight balance, applying gas when oversteering + counter steer). Electronics system cut in a lot earlier than a usual driver will react, and uses braking of specific wheels to remove the angular momentum of the spin.

In such a case of lift off oversteer on a FWD Acura, VSA probably stops the spin momentum before you react to the oversteer. Not from experience from any VSA equipped FWD cars, nor a Honda engineer here. I'd give their engineers some credit when they say braking only the outer front wheel will stop the spin momentum. Obviously there will be times where the oversteer will not be completely stopped by the VSA. Nothing is perfect. Neither are any drivers. I've even seen Lewis Hamilton caught out in the dry spinning out his vehicle. Regardless, I'd not discredit the ability of stability systems on stopping oversteering conditions, lift-off or power, FWD or RWD.

If you haven't seen this, Bosch ESP vs Tiff Needle on ice with a FWD Jaguar X-Type at 2:00 mark. SSlow motion shows it does so by braking the outer front wheel. Tiff Needle simply couldn't react and counter steer in time at 70mph on sheet ice.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3m24bjkfg0

All in all, going with Drivings Unlimited, they simply recommend you to leave ESP/VSA/DSC on if you have it on the track. It just saves your ass a lot more times than u'd imagine. Obviously one should learn to drive and not get the vehicle into oversteering conditions in the first place. However with ESP/VSA/DSC on, it dramatically reduces both power and lift-off oversteer on all vehicles on the track.

BiscottiGelato

just looked at more pics on track day... my TSX so stock, and AT, will be laughed at for the whole d ...
ACC-HE 發表於 2010-7-2 00:04

Obviously you might find it odd if you go with VCMC, as most cars are modded there. However from my experience going plenty of AutoX and track days with BMWCCBC/Drivings Umlimited, tons of AT cars, heavy beasts like 5 series or Subaru Wagons. Most people runs stock cars, stock brakes, stock pads, stock tires, etc etc. It's about having fun and learning to drive in a safe environment, not so much about souping up the car at all.

In fact, it might be a better learning experience with stock tires and stock brakes. You learn the characteristics of your tires/brakes better. It takes more skills to manage your brakes properly to not over use them and pre-maturely getting them into fading temperatures.

ACC-HE

回復 48# BiscottiGelato


    BMWCCBC/Drivings Umlimited fun?  how different are their events?

布小熊

回復 49# ACC-HE

well BG drives a BMW so it make sense to go to car club that knows about his car...

I don't know... I haven't been to many auto-x event (just watching) but I think the races have diff classes... and there is a stock class for sure. I know a friend who've been at those event for years and he is always driving his AT car. I am still waiting for their girls only driving class.... wonder if it's going to happen next year... may be...