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標題: [其他飲食] Starbucks @ Aberdeen Closing~ [打印本頁]
作者: 小叻    時間: 2009-3-31 07:47     標題: Starbucks @ Aberdeen Closing~

Just heard the radio today that Starbucks @ Aberdeen 將會係第一間係加拿大執笠既Starbucks~ I had a frd working there as Store Manager..she told me before that 一日埋數有$3000~ Is $3000 very little for Starbucks? I have no clue....
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-3-31 07:57

Just heard the radio today that Starbucks @ Aberdeen 將會係第一間係加拿大執笠既Starbucks~ I had a frd working there as Store Manager..she told me before that 一日埋數有$3000~ Is $3000 very little for  ...
小叻 發表於 2009-3-31 07:47

I heard it yesterday.
$3000 sales would be OK at some locations, i.e. Van South, Kingsway Vancouver,
but at high rent properties like Abxxxeen and Robson Street, they have to lose money for sure. There is a property on Robson street, cost $40,000 a month for rent, triple net extra
作者: myversa    時間: 2009-3-31 08:13

星巴克將首見加國分店關門         
2009年3月31日

http://www.mingpaovan.com/htm/News/20090331/vas9.htm

【明報專訊】根據CBC的報道，著名連鎖咖啡店星巴克(Starbucks)將於近期關閉列治文時代坊的咖啡店，成為金融風暴下該公司在加國的首間分店遭關閉。

該報道引用咖啡業零售商的說法，指關閉時代坊分店，除因受經濟不景氣影響外，開張以來業績不佳也是其中一個因素。在該店工作的員工已經提前5日收到通知，估計本周就會人去樓空。

儘管自全球經濟衰退以來，星巴克公司陸續宣布關閉美國境內的600間及美國以外的100間分店，但時代坊分店還是加國共365間分店中第一間被關閉的，因此頗受矚目。

有曾經光顧該店的列治文華裔居民蘇小姐對消息感吃驚，表示沒想到像星巴克這樣實力雄厚且廣受歡迎的咖啡店也會因金融風暴關門大吉，指該店位於商場大門口附近，臨近街道，位置不差，儘管確實不如列市另一主要商場內分店那樣隨時都需要排隊，但也不至於乏人問津的地步。她猜測可能與成本支出有關。但也有網友在互聯網上留言，批評星巴克咖啡價格太貴，吸引不到消費者也不奇怪。
作者: myversa    時間: 2009-3-31 08:16

I never even went into that Starbucks since the day it opened....
作者: bluemountain    時間: 2009-3-31 08:22

So sad to hear that they are closing, parking is a main problem there, need to paid parking before you walk directly to Starbuck, otherwise need to park at parking lot and walk thru the mall, very inconvenience compare to other store like Ackroyd Road and Bridgeport,  they have free parking and also drive thru as well, very convenience for the customers especially when they are rush to work in the morning.
作者: news    時間: 2009-3-31 09:07

starbucks in a chinese mall..will never work..haha
作者: kingsway    時間: 2009-3-31 09:32

bad location for it..
Probably the rent is so expensive too.
作者: raima    時間: 2009-3-31 09:51

I never even went into that Starbucks since the day it opened....
myversa 發表於 2009-3-31 09:16


same here....
作者: 毅字    時間: 2009-3-31 09:51

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作者: 毅字    時間: 2009-3-31 09:52

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作者: 布小熊    時間: 2009-3-31 09:55

wonder what store will Mr. Fung put there afterwards.
作者: chobit    時間: 2009-3-31 10:12

I have been there a couple of times at night, to meet with friends for a good chat.., so that's too bad...!
作者: 小叻    時間: 2009-3-31 10:16

wonder what store will Mr. Fung put there afterwards.
布小熊 發表於 31-3-2009 09:55

most likely a coffee shop~
作者: MSN04    時間: 2009-3-31 10:17

crap... i go there a lot...
作者: myversa    時間: 2009-3-31 10:25

there is a whitespot in aberdeen center?
作者: 嘉嘉    時間: 2009-3-31 10:25

omg, that's kinda shocking @_@
作者: 小叻    時間: 2009-3-31 10:27

there is a whitespot in aberdeen center?
myversa 發表於 31-3-2009 10:25

in the food court near the washrooms~
作者: AAC    時間: 2009-3-31 11:15

17# 小叻


講唔定，馮老闆又頂埋做。
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-3-31 11:40

starbucks in a chinese mall..will never work..haha
news 發表於 2009-3-31 10:07


There are many Starbucks in Chinese malls, in Hong Kong and China etc
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-3-31 11:41

wonder what store will Mr. Fung put there afterwards.
布小熊 發表於 2009-3-31 10:55


Bean Around the world, Timmy etc
作者: 小叻    時間: 2009-3-31 11:45

There are many Starbucks in Chinese malls, in Hong Kong and China etc
peter236 發表於 31-3-2009 11:40

obviously...news is talking about chinese malls in Canada
作者: MAXIMUS    時間: 2009-3-31 11:59

21# 小叻


No more frappacino? so sad
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-3-31 12:09

21# 小叻


No more frappacino? so sad
MAXIMUS 發表於 2009-3-31 11:59

You sounds like someone
作者: 蛋撻    時間: 2009-3-31 12:55

本帖最後由 蛋撻 於 2009-3-31 12:59 編輯

I'm not too surprise that Starbucks @ Aberdeen will close.

Afterall, I would say a high percentage of people who go to the mall will buy drinks in the food court anyway...

Me for example, I normally do enjoy a good cup of coffee from Starbucks, but @ Aberdeen, I would rather go get myself a cup of 凍檸茶 instead.

1 good note about things is that Starbucks is not cheap when you compare to a cup of HK style coffee in the food court.
作者: Catpiano    時間: 2009-3-31 13:12

I guess .. chinese are too cheap?  keep taking "SUGER"  or EMPTY CUP from there ??  lol ..

And many C 9, just sit there for hours .. without spending? or just use thier bath room?  

LOL   

Well .. starbuck in a chinese mall is already weird idea ..   

Um .. but rent in a chinese mall .. must be cheap??
作者: PreciousMoment    時間: 2009-3-31 13:26

本帖最後由 PreciousMoment 於 2009-3-31 13:31 編輯

Don't think "taking "SUGER"  or EMPTY CUP" will cause Starbucks closing down!

"rent in a chinese mall .. must be cheap??"  Not sure if you are from Vancouver... Everyone in Vancouver knows rent @ Aberdeen is unreasonable & not cheap.
作者: myversa    時間: 2009-3-31 13:45

The rent @ Aberdeen food court is more than 8 times of the rent @ Public Market.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-3-31 14:13

本帖最後由 peter236 於 2009-3-31 15:18 編輯
I guess .. chinese are too cheap?  keep taking "SUGER"  or EMPTY CUP from there ??  lol ..

And many C 9, just sit there for hours .. without spending? or just use thier bath room?  

LOL   

Well .. ...
Catpiano 發表於 2009-3-31 14:12


You anti-Chinese moron, Chinese are not cheap. There are so many Starbucks in HK and China.

There so many bathrooms in Aberdeen center, but none at that Starbucks.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-3-31 14:17

I'm not too surprise that Starbucks @ Aberdeen will close.

Afterall, I would say a high percentage of people who go to the mall will buy drinks in the food court anyway...

Me for example, I normal ...
蛋撻 發表於 2009-3-31 13:55


We should just drink our own Chinese style coffee and set up own high-class coffee chain stores.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-3-31 15:55

I had a frd working there as Store Manager..she told me before that 一日埋數有$3000~ Is $3000 very little for Starbucks? I have no clue....
小叻 發表於 2009-3-31 08:47


Honestly speaking, I would suspect that $3000 a day should be the highest sales record of that store but not the daily average sales volume. $3000 a day is already considered very good performance.

Let’s do a math calculation assuming $3,000 sales a day and all expenses to be maxed.  

Monthly income:                90,000
Rent:                        40,000
Wages:                        24,000 (8 people @ $3,000 per person per month)
Food cost                        15,000
Miscellaneous expenses:          5,000
Net income:                  6,000

From the calculation, there is no way they will lose money even given the rent is 40K per month.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-3-31 18:31

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-3-31 18:43 編輯

1# 小叻
Allow me , a no-brainer to do some simple calculation:
Assume Sales:             $90,000 x 12        $1,080,000/yr                     100%
Rent                               30,000 x 12             360,000                         33.4%                  
Payroll+Benefits             24,000 x 12             288,000                         26.7%
COGS                              15,750 x 12             189,000                         17.5%
Overhead                          9,000 x 12             108.000                         10%
Royalty+Advertising          4,500 x 12               54,000                           5%
Professional Fee               1,200 x 12               14,400                           1.4%
Loan payment:
$350,000 x 12.5% x 4 years
                                     $10,937.50x12          131,250                         12,16%


Operating deficit              -5,387.00                -66,528                           -6.16%
It is based on basic speculation on average franchise outlet, generally  the  Cost  Of Goods Sold of franchise chain are higher because the franchisee have no choice but to buy everything from the franchiser or designated suppliers with private label. I did not include utilities, common area shared expenses
and I have lowered the rent expense  by 25%.  12.5% loan interest rate is very low, usually restaurant  business carry  higher interest  so in this case they have to do at least $120,000 monthly sales just to stay in business. I do not know exactly how much it cost to set up a Starxxxxx, just compare with the Blenz's start-up cost
作者: ATGB    時間: 2009-3-31 19:21

FYI North American Starbucks are not franchises.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-3-31 19:44

FYI North American Starbucks are not franchises.
ATGB 發表於 2009-3-31 19:21

I know, that is the reason I used Blenz for comparison, the cost structure
would be very similar.  The mainstream companies use loan to finance business,
12.5% interest per annum for restaurant is considered very low for business loan.
Generally a business plan requires the investment to be recovered  in 3-4 years
period.
作者: Caffie    時間: 2009-3-31 19:45

My store's average net sales each day is about $3500. Last Monday it was $3100. Last Saturday was $4000 something. I remember when I used to work at Starbucks at the airport, from opening (5am)-10am net sales = $5000.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-3-31 19:52

My store's average net sales each day is about $3500. Last Monday it was $3100. Last Saturday was $4000 something. I remember when I used to work at Starbucks at the airport, from opening (5am)-10am n ...
Caffie 發表於 2009-3-31 19:45

$5000 sales a day in Burnaby area is very good. But At Aberxxx or Robson Street would be barely breakeven. Do you have any idea what the COGS(Food Cost)  is?
作者: 老友四號    時間: 2009-3-31 20:42

題外話：

在中國建立中國自己品牌的高级咖啡室？

咪講笑喇！在當大部分人仲隨地放飛劍，隨處踎；隨時開口得罪人的國度裡。

即使衣著再光鲜口袋裡鈔票再多也不過是暴發户而已！

根本談不上「品味」二字呀！同志！
作者: Catpiano    時間: 2009-3-31 20:47

There are many Starbucks in Chinese malls, in Hong Kong and China etc
peter236 發表於 31-3-2009 11:40

obviously...news is talking about chinese malls in Canada
小叻 發表於 2009-3-31 12:45


Don't you know ..  there is only one country in the world ? it is CHINA ..

Don't you know .. Canada is only part of China ??


According to PETER ..  LOL
作者: benyaoguai    時間: 2009-3-31 22:37

10# 毅字



i agree XD dun think it should've opened in the first place... nobody really goes there XD
i think business is worst than the 雪花冰 place XD
作者: benyaoguai    時間: 2009-3-31 22:39

Bean Around the world, Timmy etc
peter236 發表於 2009-3-31 11:41 AM



I WANT BLENZ!!
作者: fibbi    時間: 2009-3-31 22:52

39# benyaoguai


2nd that! I want blenz too!
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-1 00:06

Don't you know ..  there is only one country in the world ? it is CHINA ..

Don't you know .. Canada is only part of China ??


According to PETER ..  LOL
Catpiano 發表於 2009-3-31 21:47


Please do not talk rubbish.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-1 00:08

題外話：

在中國建立中國自己品牌的高级咖啡室？

咪講笑喇！在當大部分人仲隨地放飛劍，隨處踎；隨時開口得罪人的國度裡。

即使衣著再光鲜口袋裡鈔票再多也不過是暴發户而已！

根本談不上「品味」二字呀！同志！ ...
老友四號 發表於 2009-3-31 21:42


Please STFU, okay?
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-1 02:16

本帖最後由 rockypath 於 2009-4-1 03:34 編輯

31# somewhereintime

Your calculation just makes me want to laugh. You made up all the assumptions are just to make it to have a lost. Just give your one example. The interest rate on my family’s business credit card 8%, and the interest rate for overdraw on the business account is 6%. How high an interest rate do you expect us to pay on bank loan? I can tell you, it is much less than 12.5% and it is single digit.

$3,000 per day is a normal sales volume for a Starbucks shop and it is profitable. My point is that I suspect the store at Aberdeen makes much less than $3,000 a day and that is the reason causing it to be closed down.

I would expect the rent in Richmond Center to be higher than the rent in Aberdeen Center. Why people don’t complain about Richmond Center? It is because it can draw high volume of customer flow.

It is not the rent at Aberdeen kills the Starbucks. It is rather the lack of customer flow kills it.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-1 05:36

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-4-1 05:49 編輯

We are living in a real world, you would pay 0% interest on your car, 3-5% on a new
house. I have a 250,000 line of credit with 3.5% interest. Try to talk to your bank manager
and request a business loan  for restaurant without collateral  and see what happen.
Or try to talk to Mr. Fung to take over the lease with all the chattels included, try to hire
all the staffs at $6.00 training rate and you will make a fortune easily.
A Korean couples spent $350,000 to start a Blenz franchise at BCIT Downtown Campus,
end up walking out of lease after 2 years in business and $100,000 operating deficit. A typical foodcourt space at Abxxxxxx costs $8,000 rent a month so guest how much Starxxxx would have to pay? This explains why the foodcourt always has30-40% vacancy.   Who would think of starting a restaurant without start-up investment and the fund to keep the business going for the first 6 months which would be around $500,000.  For a successful restaurant,  an operator need to achieve 12-15% net profit after all the expenses and loan payment paid, and himself/herself paid too.
The 7 Heaxxx could not manage to balance the book even the monthly sales exceeded $300,000(I got the info from their accountant).
Everyone could be a restaurant consultant, even he know nothing about the nature of business.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-1 08:54

本帖最後由 rockypath 於 2009-4-1 09:59 編輯
We are living in a real world, you would pay 0% interest on your car, 3-5% on a new
house. I have a 250,000 line of credit with 3.5% interest. Try to talk to your bank manager
and request a business l ...
somewhereintime 發表於 2009-4-1 06:36


Do you have any idea what you are talking about?

I can teach you how to defeat my argument.
1)        My argument is - "this store makes significantly less than $3,000 a day and that is the reason it is closed down (this is my educational guess)"
2)        To defeat my argument, you only need to prove that it makes more than $3,000 a day.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-1 09:15

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-4-1 09:44 編輯

45# rockypath

I  have no desire to argue, just read Caffie's post #34 you would know what is the average  daily sales for a not-so-busy outlet.
Properties command high rent because they assume the tentants would generate higher  sales  in ratio to the traffic.
My last post was  answer to post#1, did you notice that I do not usually reply to
yours, Mr. T & Mr. P 's post, this is a rare exception.
Since when a legitimate business start-up do not involve  investment, loan interest, opex and utilities, those components were  not mention in your  "educational " statement. I just gave some No-brainer's thought as I put in the very beginning. I made a lowly  local Wonton House come up with $300,000  monthly cash sales for decade  back in 90's and have been performing consultation services to large foodservice groups as well as teaching the topic. I would know a thing or two about restaurant business.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-1 10:04

46# somewhereintime


A No-brainer can tell that I answer directly to the question asked by post #1 ($3,000 a day can not keep the store open?) and you are talking something else in blue.

You have mentioned your "background" so many times on LYK already and you don’t have to repeat it again and again. However, you seem to have difficulties to understand what other people have said and answer the questions directly and make your logic clear.

Just for you benefit, I say it again. My educational guess is – “THIS STORE MAKES LESS THAN $3,000 A DAY”, but not how I make up all the assumptions for the calculation.

In fact, I also want to confirm whether my educational guess is correct or not.
作者: 毅字    時間: 2009-4-1 10:10

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作者: 毅字    時間: 2009-4-1 10:11

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作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-1 10:24

how to open a starbuck? how much? $200,000?
毅字 發表於 2009-4-1 10:11

As someone posted on #32, Starxxxx in North America are not franchise, they are
chain shops and their strategy is  public exposure, you will see 1 on every major street. Therefore they establish some locations even it is not feasible, e.g. on West Georgia where the rent is prime and no evening and weekend business.
Their location in Italian community on Commercial is a disaster in term of business, but again for the sake of exposure, they need one outlet there.
Back to your question, you cannot open a Starxxxx other than buying their stocks.
But if you want to start a upscale coffee shop, it would cost you anywhere from $100,000 to $250,000. BTW, the Fed has a program BIL(Small Business Improvement Loan) up to $250,000 available to Canadian, you just have to come up with 25% of the actual investment and a viable business plan. Go talk to your bank. Good Luck.
作者: Caffie    時間: 2009-4-1 16:34

how to open a starbuck? how much? $200,000?
毅字 發表於 2009-4-1 10:11

More like it would cost a million bucks.. but yeah, no franchise.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-1 17:17

More like it would cost a million bucks.. but yeah, no franchise.
Caffie 發表於 2009-4-1 16:34

So how's the foodcost %  like?  In term of food, not beverage.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-1 20:05

本帖最後由 peter236 於 2009-4-1 21:07 編輯

Did Aberdeen cafe actually make $300,000 sales in a month? That is $10,000 a day, including the slow days. Assuming each customer spends $20, that means they need to have 500 customers a day.
If they could not balance the books, then how could the Taiwanese restaurant next door?
作者: 毅字    時間: 2009-4-1 21:54

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作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-1 23:08

Did Aberdeen cafe actually make $300,000 sales in a month? That is $10,000 a day, including the slow days. Assuming each customer spends $20, that means they need to have 500 customers a day.
If they  ...
peter236 發表於 2009-4-1 21:05


You are actually smart this time. I had noticed this but did not bother to question it since I don’t want to the bad guy again.  

How many seats does 7 Heaxxx have? Maybe 50-60? Each single seat must be “turned” 10 times a day. Do you believe it is possible?

How often do we see 7 Heaxxx had a full house? Anyone who has the capability to do simple mathematic calculation will easily realize $300K a month is just a silly joke.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-2 00:23

You are actually smart this time. I had noticed this but did not bother to question it since I don’t want to the bad guy again.  

How many seats does 7 Heaxxx have? Maybe 50-60? Each single seat m ...
rockypath 發表於 2009-4-2 00:08


I went there many times on different days and from my observation, even on a busy Saturday, they still had problems having 500 customers a day. Now, just think about how many customers they had on the slow weekdays. We don't even know how he could make up the $300,000 a month sales number.
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-2 06:12

I went there many times on different days and from my observation, even on a busy Saturday, they still had problems having 500 customers a day. Now, just think about how many customers they had on t ...
peter236 發表於 2009-4-2 01:23

You work there?
作者: MSN04    時間: 2009-4-2 09:39

52# somewhereintime

Why you keep asking?
I thought a consultant like you should have a pretty good idea already.
b/c even outsider like me who is not even in the business know the food cost at starbucks lol
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-2 10:33

58# MSN04


I also call myself as a "consultant". Are you willing to hire me? No need to pay me. A free lunch is what I am asking for.
作者: MyOMy    時間: 2009-4-2 10:55

If my memory serve me correct, a new Starbug set up costs US$250,000 on average. This is a 2007 figures.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-2 13:39

If my memory serve me correct, a new Starbug set up costs US$250,000 on average. This is a 2007 figures.
MyOMy 發表於 2009-4-2 11:55

Do you mind to tell us from where you got this figure? Is there any other figures you can share? I am very interested in knowing.
作者: Littleprince    時間: 2009-4-2 14:34

Do you mind to tell us from where you got this figure? Is there any other figures you can share? I am very interested in knowing.
rockypath 發表於 2009-4-2 14:39

you want to open one? no la... too many already

in Burnaby around Metrotown area, there are 4, a bit too many
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-2 15:00

a 52# somewhereintime

Why you keep asking?
I thought a consultant like you should have a pretty good idea already.
b/c even outsider like me who is not even in the business know the food cost at star ...
MSN04 發表於 2009-4-2 09:39

What  I have on hand is what the reasonable market value of the supply, however, in a chain/franchise business, it is not the case.
You're strip off the freedom for shopping around for the best deal but to deal with the
designated suppliers, everything is written on the contract.
My younger brother had worked as a manager  at  Donxxx for 20 years, the price they pay for inventory is about 20-30% higher than the commercial suppliers. No matter how big the volume is. For example: a case of Sugar envelope from Sysco, the Roger's  Brand was $14 but the same thing with Mc Doxxxx private label cost $18. Same thing happen to the sanitation supplies from Ecolab.
I've never work for Starxxxx just curious how much the outlet pays for the inventory
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-2 15:03

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-4-2 15:04 編輯
a 52# somewhereintime

Why you keep asking?
I thought a consultant like you should have a pretty good idea already.
b/c even outsider like me who is not even in the business know the food cost at star ...
MSN04 發表於 2009-4-2 09:39

What  I have on hand is what the reasonable market value of the supplies, however, in a chain/franchise business, it is not the case.
You're stripped  off the freedom for shopping around for the best deal but to deal with the
designated suppliers, everything is written on the contract.
My younger brother had worked as a manager  at  Donxxx for 20 years, the price they pay for inventory is about 20-30% higher than the commercial suppliers. No matter how big the volume is. For example: a case of Sugar envelope from Sysco, the Roger's  Brand was $14 but the same thing with Mc Doxxxx private label cost $18. Same thing happen to the sanitation supplies from Ecolab.
I've never work for Starxxxx just curious how much the outlet pays for the inventory
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-2 15:24

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-4-2 15:47 編輯

56# peter236
There are more than one way to bring in revenue for business.
Since you're paying  the prime  rent  24/7, why restrict yourself by the square footage/number of seat?   Have you heard about off-site catering?
They used to supply all the food to the Hainamese Chicken place at Food court
and other outlets, they double as central kitchen as well.
There are hundred of legal ways to make money in restaurant business. I used to do $5, 000 daily sales  in a small 700 ft  coffee house, some
15 years ago at $20 /ft premises. Speaking of impossible.
I express my humble POV here as an ordinally LYK member,  you do not have to believe me or waste time reading them.
The figure I obtained from a respectable professional  accountant. If anyone want
her to reveal more detail, I can arrange for a meeting, but I cannot  expose more confidential info.
My question to anyone interested in food business:
Why would you ever consider investing  $1,000,000 to start a restaurant  in a prime retail property if you cannot manage to bring in $300,000 revenue a month?
And I can share a real story:
A so called upscale bakery group , according to their  P & L Statement
For every $100 revenue they brought  in, would cost them $142, yes, $142.00,
not for months, it has been going- on for  14 years until they finally sold the business. And they are considered  to be the elite business group in BC
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-2 16:15

soooo many false information on here LOL

somewhereintime
why do you even bother explaining how to do business to peter236? he will never understand.

anyways
peter236, i can give u 300k and start your so call high end chinese coffee shop at the starbucks location in aberdeen.  I will give you 3 months to get $150k margin a month.  you can keep the 300k that i gave you.  if you failed, you'll owe me 3 times the amount.
i'll just laugh so hard when i sue your ass off once you close the shop in 2 months.
作者: Caffie    時間: 2009-4-2 16:30

Caffie, 開間細STARBUCK要一百萬加斃﹖係唔 lun 係呀﹖
毅字 發表於 2009-4-1 21:54

要架. 兩部Espresso Machine 都要四五萬, 仲有啲裝修呀其他equipment 呀計計埋埋都要一百萬.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-2 17:48

66# Hyde

Thank you for your advice sir.
Your proposal sounds very challenging, I'd love to watch the match between you and Mr. P
As for myself, I would not want to have anything to do with your buddy Mr. Fung.
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-2 18:13

本帖最後由 somewhereintime 於 2009-4-2 18:16 編輯
要架. 兩部Espresso Machine 都要四五萬, 仲有啲裝修呀其他equipment 呀計計埋埋都要一百萬.
Caffie 發表於 2009-4-2 16:30

That is the type of answer I'm soliciting.  I know how to negotiate with the suppliers  for the best possible deal on behalf of the client. Starting a Staxxxxxx type of coffee shop would cost $150K-$250K, with matching equipments and  interior/exterior work.
The COGS would be significantly decrease.  The espresso machines are the most expensive equipment in this case, but you can always lease all  the equipments.
The Blenz franchise costs $300K and the Pedro's Organic Coffee House $240K
so the numbers are quite close.
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-2 22:06

老奉會開間百佳咖啡- Poxxa 仆×咖啡
日式佢最啱
作者: Guy    時間: 2009-4-2 22:27

Honestly speaking, I would suspect that $3000 a day should be the highest sales record of that store but not the daily average sales volume. $3000 a day is already considered very good performance.  ...
rockypath 發表於 2009-3-31 16:55



How about let me correct you here.


Monthly income:                1,200 daily average x30 = 36,000
Rent:                        8,300  
Wages:                       278 Staff hours per week * $10 middle rate *4wk = 11120
Food cost          use the retail margin 50% the average income 36000 *50% = 18,000
Do the simple math
       36000-8300-11120-18000=-1420 per month

I haven't include that Miscellaneous expenses like napkins and toliet paper and honey and the lease of the equipment.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-2 22:47

56# peter236
There are more than one way to bring in revenue for business.
Since you're paying  the prime  rent  24/7, why restrict yourself by the square footage/number of seat?   Have you heard a ...
somewhereintime 發表於 2009-4-2 16:24


First, how would a respectful and professional accountant would release the confidential data to an outsider like you? Is it called “respectful” and “professional”?

Second, did 7 Heaxxx managed to double its kitchen? That means they had an efficient operation model which any restaurant operator would dream to achieve. The fixed cost ratio would decrease greatly and they had a much better control on the variable costs. The utilization rate must be high both for its equipments and employees.

Then, you would have a harder time to justify why it could not balance its book for:
1)        Having an efficient operation model – double the facility
2)        $300K per month of income
3)        Paying very little rent (I wouldn’t be surprised if they paid no rent at all, and I believe some people on LYK know this as well)
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-2 23:01

How about let me correct you here.


Monthly income:                1,200 daily average x30 = 36,000
Rent:                        8,300  
Wages:                       278 Staff hours per week * $10 ...
Guy 發表於 2009-4-2 23:27


Thanks for your correction. Is it the real data reflecting the operation of that store?

Regardless of the real numbers of the costs are, my point is – “if it makes $3,000 or more a day, it will be profitable and be able to stay open; my guess is that it cannot make that much and it makes significantly less than $3,000 a day”.

Your calculation is inline with my conclusion (daily income = $1,200) unless you would say the otherwise.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-2 23:24

本帖最後由 peter236 於 2009-4-3 00:25 編輯
soooo many false information on here LOL

somewhereintime
why do you even bother explaining how to do business to peter236? he will never understand.

anyways
peter236, i can give u 300k and start you ...
Hyde 發表於 2009-4-2 17:15


You moron, I didn't say we should open another coffee shop at Aberdeen. That location may not be viable at all. My plans are more ambitious than that. So please broaden your horizon.

I was saying that the Chinese companies, whether in HK or China should set up a Chinese managed high-class coffee chain store. This is in response to multi-national chains like Starbucks and others. Obviously, many Chinese people like coffee, so we need to attract those customers rather than just allow foreigners make all the money from us.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-2 23:27

老奉會開間百佳咖啡- Poxxa 仆×咖啡
日式佢最啱
sheep 發表於 2009-4-2 23:06


Many pro-Japan people like Japanese coffee. He has Japanese cream puffs, pizza, hello Kitty already, so why not Japanese coffee.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-2 23:50

There are more than one way to bring in revenue for business.
Since you're paying  the prime  rent  24/7, why restrict yourself by the square footage/number of seat?   Have you heard a ...
somewhereintime 發表於 2009-4-2 16:24


Now you are claiming that they supply Hainan chicken to the food court. So how many other sideline business do they have? We cannot do an accurate calculation without all the relevant information.

The point here is that they can't make $300,000 in sales a month, without significant sideline business.
作者: MyOMy    時間: 2009-4-3 00:35

Do you mind to tell us from where you got this figure? Is there any other figures you can share? I am very interested in knowing.
rockypath 發表於 2009-4-2 14:39


Sorry, that is my memory, I have no proof. A couple of years back, a friend of mine planned to open a coffee shop. He showed me his home work, this was part of the figures he had that imprinted my mind.   I think the figure is quite real for a small coffee shop.
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-3 01:10

You moron, I didn't say we should open another coffee shop at Aberdeen. That location may not be viable at all. My plans are more ambitious than that. So please broaden your horizon.

I was saying t ...
peter236 發表於 2009-4-3 00:24


your plans??? you cant even operate a small coffee shop, and you want to have a competing company to starbucks... WOW....  u might as well just dream the what 7 numbers that will come up for Super 7!
HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
please... i want to see your chinese coffee shop succeed!!! but you have to use CHINA grown beans, not from Taiwan, but CHINA....  remember, all the sourcing must be from china, including all the materials to renovate the shop down to the most basic source, water also have to be imported from China!!!

btw, there are already coffee chain in china, and they are a failure.  they can't even produce a simple cup of coffee that is up to international standard.  how the fxck do you think that it can become an international brand?  please... use your brain and stop jacking off to those pork chop at the maid cafe!
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-3 01:39

your plans??? you cant even operate a small coffee shop, and you want to have a competing company to starbucks... WOW....  u might as well just dream the what 7 numbers that will come up for Super 7 ...
Hyde 發表於 2009-4-3 02:10


You moron, China produces high class coffee beans on the tropical island of Hainan province. But since Starbucks and others can import coffee beans from all over the world, why can't our Chinese coffee chain store import coffee beans from all over the world? By the way, you dumb fuc, Taiwan province is part of China.

You dumb fuc can shut down your business empire in China, if you hate Chinese people so much.
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-3 02:08

本帖最後由 Hyde 於 2009-4-3 03:14 編輯

你條電車男咪試下同D台灣人講 台灣係屬於中國幾一部份睇下你有冇命出返黎先算啦

你講咁撚多費話都係想話比人聽你冇腦， 唔駛架， 我地個個都知。 不過你冇腦， lee D 最簡單嘅道理又點會明。

你咁撚鐘意大陸你點解係加拿大學人講乜春英文， 快D返大陸啦柒頭。 不過你咁撚on9，返大陸用stem cell都冇得醫

btw, 我唔係hate chinese people，係hate 你條廢柴， 唔該唔好影衰中國人啦，中華民俗有你lee D on9仔就真係恥辱
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-3 02:16

Sorry, that is my memory, I have no proof. A couple of years back, a friend of mine planned to open a coffee shop. He showed me his home work, this was part of the figures he had that imprinted my m ...
MyOMy 發表於 2009-4-3 01:35


$250K to setup a small regular coffee shop should be sufficient. But I am not sure whether it is sufficient for setting up a regular Starbucks shop (not a Starbucks in food court) since its equipments are quite expensive especially the fully automatic espresso machine. ~$40K a piece. The cost of renovation (including building, electrical, plumbing, etc) is very high as well.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-3 02:25

本帖最後由 peter236 於 2009-4-3 03:27 編輯
你條電車男咪試下同D台灣人講 台灣係屬於中國幾一部份睇下你有冇命出返黎先算啦

你講咁撚多費話都係想話比人聽你冇腦， 唔駛架， 我地個個都知。 不過你冇腦， lee D 最簡單嘅道理又點會明。

你咁撚鐘意大陸你點 ...
Hyde 發表於 2009-4-3 03:08


You stupid moron, why would you hate someone else on the internet? We don't even know each other. You are like those immature kids who like to make enemies on the internet. You are just a 隱蔽青年, pretending to be smart. Be careful, the Chinese will kick your business out if you misbehave again.
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-3 02:30

你收皮啦， 你唔出你D白癡post就真係唔該你喇。
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-3 06:07

Many pro-Japan people like Japanese coffee. He has Japanese cream puffs, pizza, hello Kitty already, so why not Japanese coffee.
peter236 發表於 2009-4-3 00:27

Have you ever seen a line up of Japanese outside these stores?
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-3 06:10

your plans??? you cant even operate a small coffee shop, and you want to have a competing company to starbucks... WOW....  u might as well just dream the what 7 numbers that will come up for Super 7 ...
Hyde 發表於 2009-4-3 02:10

nei hau.

Must speak mandarine
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-3 06:28

老奉會開間百佳咖啡- Poxxa 仆×咖啡
日式佢最啱
sheep 發表於 2009-4-2 22:06

Polka Dots?
作者: somewhereintime    時間: 2009-4-3 07:42

62# Littleprince

As I mentioned earlier, it is their marketing strategy to have an  outlet
anywhere you go.  It is American way, might not work in Canada.
I published an article " Why did the mega US  restaurant franchise fail
in Canada" in  Hospitality & Foodservice magazine  back in 1998 with
supporting stats and document.
We have seen the doom of Planet Hollywood, Soft Rock Cafe, Kenny
Roger's, Black Angus...... just to name a few. Local marketing studies
is recommended   if anyone planning to start a food business.
I've read thousands of  P & L statements from open source and found
many bizarre  stories
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-3 10:29

you want to open one? no la... too many already

in Burnaby around Metrotown area, there are 4, a bit too many
Littleprince 發表於 2009-4-2 15:34


No la... my family already predicted that Starbucks will slow down or run into troubles a few years back when it was at its peak and rapidly continue to expand.

it is not how good we know about the busienss, it is just because we did not believe in the way and the speed it expanded its business.
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-3 10:40

本帖最後由 peter236 於 2009-4-3 11:45 編輯
Have you ever seen a line up of Japanese outside these stores?
sheep 發表於 2009-4-3 07:07


Just a bunch of Japanese wannabes lining up for cream puffs, not as many as before, especially now they have a few stores locally. There are not as many Japanese as Chinese locally. Maybe they should open a Kintaro in Aberdeen to attract some more Japanese.
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-3 14:31

nei hau.

Must speak mandarine
sheep 發表於 2009-4-3 07:10


also all the signs must be in simplified chinese.  and all the english must be translated by online translation service!!!!
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-3 14:49

also all the signs must be in simplified chinese.  and all the english must be translated by online translation service!!!!
Hyde 發表於 2009-4-3 15:31


You can ask the Japanese friends to translate into English, since the Japanese have superior English ability.
作者: Hyde    時間: 2009-4-3 15:08

收皮啦，　人同紧你讲野， 我系同紧Sheep讲. 惊你条大陆仔唔识睇繁体字，用简体
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-3 22:31

日本皮儍 加 泡夫?
作者: RayRay    時間: 2009-4-3 23:06

Aberdeen Center ripe off tenant
作者: peter236    時間: 2009-4-3 23:19

日本皮儍 加 泡夫?
sheep 發表於 2009-4-3 23:31

我估計你地Aberdeen一定越來越多日本貨買。
作者: MyOMy    時間: 2009-4-3 23:26

点解"你地"? LYK有新紙袋高层, 馮人發家族？
作者: Littleprince    時間: 2009-4-3 23:28

EDITED
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-4 02:40

Aberdeen Center ripe off tenant
RayRay 發表於 2009-4-4 00:06


A friend of mine had a small shop at Aberdeen last year. However, it was a sad experience. He had to give it all up less than a year in business.

The most troublesome part was the lease contract. However, I don't know how he resolved it at last since he returned to Taiwan already and haven't talked to him since.
作者: rockypath    時間: 2009-4-4 03:24

I passed by the store today and found it was already closed down. Just want to get the last cup of coffee from it. Too bad, didn't make it.
作者: sheep    時間: 2009-4-4 09:04

I've got the last cup of coffee and I haven't drink it cause I will sell it on eBay after the mall close down.



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