Lik

Democracy doesn't eliminate corruption at all.
peter236 發表於 2009-11-30 10:28

Of course democracy doesn't eliminate corruption, but at least it allows for measures to keep it in check. But I suppose you prefer the Mainland style anti-corruption methods instead?!

Sir Winston Churchill once said that "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all those others that have been tried.", and no truer words could have been said.

-Lik

Lik

從目前可見嘅事實來睇，五區邊相公投依然係誓在必行，社民連同公民黨嘅兩幫人依然係 on track 咁去斟酌同安排辭職公投嘅細節。最後會唔會只係得社民連三子來做個辭職抗議呢啲咁無謂嘅揣測，我覺得響現階段講來都係多餘嘅。

如果告得入嘅話，人地要告咪告囉。難聽係難聽㗎喇，但我自問寫得好清楚，係咪誹謗咪等個官判囉。擺明蝕晒大本嘅蛇羹、旅行、燒野食，你夠薑咪學澳門咁請人地食餐投票前後嘅一蚊大餐囉。做到咁揚，唔係合法「賄選」、谷票、配票、同「買票」仲可以係乜野呀？

-力

Lik

新界西應該係大舊陳偉業。如果百鴿黨肯有返多少承擔、有返多少腰骨，呢個位本應係何俊仁去嘅。

響任何人準備投票俾百鴿黨之前，我想問吓佢百鴿黨呢廿幾年來爭取過、同爭取到啲乜野呢？香港人俾佢呃咗廿幾年，由八八直選到依家，得到嘅民主晉程有幾多呢？話晒毓民隻蕉一出，啲公公婆婆就即刻袋多 ＄300 生果金，而呢一年來議題、抗爭、同議會文化都不斷改進。

一個呃咗你廿幾年，一個即刻有 result。有得揀嘅話，點解仲要投俾個無鬼用嘅政黨呢？

-力

Lik

71# mcjohnjohn
其實泛民邊個出來選都無分別，因為今次要選嘅係議題，係香港人要唔盡快普選。2012又好，普選路線圖又好，港人要申訴嘅係

「我地要普選！！！」

，而唔係選唔選返邊個泛民代表入議會。

MJJ，如果你唔明呢一點嘅話，咁你就完全 miss 咗今次變相公投嘅真正意義啦。

-力

Lik

力力, 小弟想講既係, 香港人唔係你想像中咁單純... 「我地要普選！！！」 唔代表要投一個自己唔like 既人入立法會.
小弟明白呢次公投嘅真正意義, 但係亦深信有好多人唔係咁諗. 小弟覺得白鴿黨都有呢個顧慮...

BS la. These guys have to resign first in order to trigger the referendum -- they are already in LegCo to begin with, you know?! By voting them back in, you're voicing your support for a generally elected HKSAR CEO and a fully and directly elected LegCo. You are supporting the cause of the referendum. You are NOT just voting the person back into LegCo.

-Lik

Lik

其實佢地係唔係只有咁樣做先可以做到全民公投既效果?
我只怕泛民o係立法會既人數不足以否決政府一d 勞民傷財既議案, 我靠哂佢地監察政府架!
mcjohnjohn 發表於 2009-12-1 22:32

MJJ, you (and a lot of HK citizens) really need to understand how LegCo works.

I don't have a crystal clear idea of how their stupid system works either, but I do know that for a lot of the policies to pass, LegCo only requires a simple majority (over 50% support). With the presence of functional constituency, the HKSAR gov will almost always get their wishes granted. IIRC, the stupid highspeed train funding approval falls under this type of rule. This is one reason why we need to get rid of the evil functional constituency.

For some other policies, I think it needs majority support within both the functional constituency and among the directly elected members. If majority support is absent in either group, the bill falls through. Given the vast difference in views between the pan-democrats and the establishments, this requirement essentially renders LegCo to be completely useless.

For gov and/or policies proposed by the CEO (not 100% certain here), LegCo needs 2/3 majority support to pass. HKSAR CEO's policy address / policy reform bills fall under this category. This is why some people say the pan-democrats need to maintain the 23 seats in LegCo to veto the government's policies.

-Lik

Lik

咁係唔係因為民主黨投棄權票而唔支持佢地呢?
唉, 佢支持又好, 反對又好, 都有佢既理由, 呢d 野我都控制唔到.
其實, 佢地棄權之後, 動議係唔係一定可以通過? 佢地點解投棄權而唔投反對or贊成? 呢度有冇人知? ...
mcjohnjohn 發表於 2009-12-2 07:09

Wrong!

As voters, you have the power to influence and change their stance. As elected members of LegCo, Democratic party candidates are supposed to listen to their voters. They certainly don't have to, but voters will punish them in the next election by casting their votes for someone else. This is how democracy works.

Based on the stuff you wrote, it is obvious to me that you don't really believe in the democratic system, nor do you really understand how it works. Sad.

-Lik

Lik

49% 不 支 持 辭 職 議 員 返 議 會

http://www.singtao.com/yesterday/loc/1215ao14.html
daimo 發表於 2009-12-14 13:05

Polls like this are completely meaningless. At the time when Yuk Man first started campaigning for a seat in LegCo last year, he was rated dead last at first (with a meager 2 or 3% support or something). And even though that support number gradually built up, the end result was completely different from the preliminary polls with him turning into the Ballot King for all practical purposes.

Additionally, voters need to be educated on what the referendum is all about. It is not a simple by-election as the Pigeon Party would like to portray it. Rather, it is a de facto referendum to ask if voters in HK would like to see a generally elected CEO and Legislative Council. With the negative press that the Pigeon Party is trying to paint the movement as, it is no surprise that a lot of voters misunderstood this and thought the entire issue was a farce.

Give the voters some time to learn about and understand the core issue, and we'll see the results for real when the ballots are counted.

-Lik

Lik

時栘勢易
今次好難講
sheep 發表於 2009-12-14 14:53

Yes, that is true too. Which is all the more reason why we ought to educate those around us about the true meaning of this referendum.

The LSD folks (and the CP folks) are certainly prepared for the worst. Between the 2 parties, they need to cough up HKD$300M for the campaign -- this will have to come from a lot of fund raising activities. At the same time, the referendum also serves as a golden opportunity to educate the public about what democracy is and what it means. On a per capita basis, it'll work out to be extremely cheap, and is far less invasive than other means of democratic education.

-Lik

Lik

特衰政府對公投／補選所做埋嘅卑鄙賤格小動作，由上至曾特狗帶頭出來施壓話唔投票，到下至選區使橫手來打擊公投嘅宣傳，眼睛雪亮嘅人都睇得出個政府有賤格。

Soli之流嘅走狗，收嗲啦～

-力