mcjohnjohn

小弟係基督徒, 上文講既內容, 是說出作者對"不成熟的基督徒"的看法.

文中一開首便將基督徒分為"成熟的基督徒" 和"不成熟的基督徒", 並舉出現今社會上仍然存在著"大量"不成熟的基督徒. 根據辭典, 大量即數量多, 但究竟有幾多? 然而作者未有對"大量"一詞作出解釋, 不知是否出自任何正式統計. 究竟"成熟的基督徒"多, 還是"不成熟的基督徒"呢?

小弟完全認同這世界一定有作者所謂的"不成熟的基督徒".  

mcjohnjohn

何謂"成熟的基督徒" 和"不成熟的基督徒"?

我想﹐這個世界上沒有一個可以稱為完全成熟的基督徒吧
人有7情6慾﹐自私﹐貪婪﹐凶殘......只要基督徒是人﹐就不可能有例外

人當然有7情6慾, 人係自私, 貪婪, 凶殘, 因為人就係人.
冇呢D野既, 就係神.
就算係一個"完全成熟的基督徒", 都會有以上特徵, 因為佢地始終都係人.

早前有機會去join一個教會event, 發覺那些教友本身只係對"自己友"nice﹐但對不認同他們 or 對他們的一些事有些意見的時候(註: 那個不是我哦﹐我承認我無gut,但我覺得在人家地頭搞事﹐而搞完事後又改變不了他們的話是"waste gas")﹐他們對會去群起攻之。那﹐他們是不是成熟的基督徒呢?

"群起攻之"? 可否舉例並說明之?
有D學生做左D唔正確既事, 老師去教佢, 勸佢, 個學生都可能會覺得比老師"群起攻之"的...

還有﹐我經常聽到一些基督徒說某些和他們不同見解的基督徒不是真的基督徒﹐他們才是。那不是傲慢是甚麼? 聖經白讀了嗎?

基督徒就是基督徒. 什麼是不同見解? 我係天主教徒, 信基督, 我自認係基督徒. 基徒教都係信基督, 我都覺得大家都係基督徒. 如果一個信佛的人, 我真係會認為佢唔係基督徒, 咁係唔係有錯呢?

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 starbug 於 2009-1-6 14:04 發表
我認為呢段歴史可能祇係一講咗千幾年嘅大話, one of the marketing mix.
祇要有第一批人信咗, 信到爆咗廠嗰隻, 咁呢個歴史故事就會不停咁roll落去, 就算明知有錯有漏洞都會有人同佢摭摭掩掩落去, 尤其係一斑既得利益團體, 甚至不惜逼害異教徒, 甚至殺人滅口.

教徒既睇法同你既睇法就唔同喇.
我信架. 點解? 因為我信law, 吹咩~
(小弟係自閉型教徒, 唔會主動叫人信教. 不過, 宗教信仰就好似跟大佬咁, 出面既人見你跟得幾風光, 好似跟左一個好既大佬, 就會有人一齊join)

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 shutterbug 於 2009-1-6 14:23 發表
Church is a 得利益團體?  Lots of church (some I don't want to mention cuz they push people to donate) gave pretty much everything for free, how is it making a profit?

Can you be more specific about "有錯有漏洞" and in what aspect?

天主教既神父同修女, 都有收津貼(人工)既. 小弟讀既中學, 好多神父揸車出面, 我當年覺得佢地好以好富貴架!

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 Ultraman 於 2009-1-6 16:20 發表
We have no idea what religious background katamari is, he/she only brought up a discussion. But obviously you are a Christian or at least a Christianity believer and is trying to defend immediately. If there are really those two types of Christians-- "immature" and "mature" ones, you may fall into the "immature" category already.

Ultraman, what if there is someone on LYK who "greet" your whole family? Would you defend or fight back?
For me, I don't think defend or fight back is immature. If you treasure something and someone wants to damage it, it is normal to defend.

Do you think it is immature to classify someone's maturity? hahaha

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 Ultraman 於 2009-1-6 17:14 發表 Why playing Mah Jong is not allowed (should say prohibited) in church but poker cards is (usually used for bridge games)?

邊個同你講架?... 小弟六歲開始打麻雀, 打到廿幾歲先開始唔打乍.

However, Christians can have anger feeling, and if they feel angry and want to vent out, they can drink a big glass of water, take a shower, shout out loud... , and why not swearing (to nobody) just to release their own anger?

邊個同你講架?... 小弟讀書既時期講好多粗口的, 出左黎做野就冇講了.

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 chunsh 於 2009-1-7 00:00 發表
read the bible and see who offend who first

請問係邊一篇? 大約第幾章同第幾節?

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 Ultraman 於 2009-1-7 05:02 發表
I think the original passage is to point out "基督徒八大惡劣特徵", not "基督教八大惡劣特徵". Who dare to say those 8 characters are not commonly found within Christians (say "immature ones)? The writer didn't say/against anything of "Jesus" and Christianity at all. But then (as usual and expected), many Christians and believers came out to defend hard of what they believe without rational discussion. That's definitely not what non-believers want to see.

At least, I have admitted that there are "不成熟基督徒" in the early post.
Only when someone started to say there is no God, blah blah blah, I discussed with you guys my opinion, what's wrong?

Ultraman, how rational do you want in this discussion? I am okay with rational discussion. Let's start then.

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 chunsh 於 2009-1-7 05:17 發表
此乃一些believes在辯論中一些慣常用的技倆---轉移目標
無錯我曾經批評過神造論﹐但我係想引出他們的一些在辯論既時候既一些問題
you know what? 我成功了。一次又一次的顯露給別人看他們怎樣同時用同一個human
logic去支持自己的理念和deny別人對他們理念的質疑

more real-life example can be given

我諗冇人可以做一個實驗比你睇去證明呢個世界上有人law. 如果你覺得咁係成功, 你真係成功了! 恭喜哂~

mcjohnjohn

原帖由 Ultraman 於 2009-1-7 05:22 發表
Why it is so difficult to understand why there are many people (non-believers) still not believing this Jesus God (Christinity)?

In my opinion, it is very EASY to understand the reason that many people do not believe Jesus.

Now is talking about Jesus the Christianity God, even 1000x times more abstract and 1000x times more incredible, also can't define/judge/understand by human logic and knowledge, plus many common bad examples around, how to convince people to believe?

你信唔信耶穌從死者中復活? 信唔信天主為左拯救世人而派遣耶穌為大家贖罪丫?
對non-believer 黎講, 一定唔會信. 但對我黎講, 我真係好信架woh.